[
  {
    "start": 0.0,
    "end": 4.94,
    "text": "Cyber security today exists in a space where attackers move faster than policies."
  },
  {
    "start": 5.8,
    "end": 15.04,
    "text": "AI-driven threats can spin up entire architectures in minutes, and nation states are quietly harvesting encrypted data for the day that quantum breaks it open."
  },
  {
    "start": 16.1,
    "end": 22.1,
    "text": "The most dangerous thing business could do right now is assume everything's fine because everything isn't."
  },
  {
    "start": 23.7,
    "end": 23.96,
    "text": "Dr."
  },
  {
    "start": 24.02,
    "end": 33.34,
    "text": "Jase Cunningham, also known as Doctor Zero Trust reminds us that trust is a human emotion and one that has no place in the digital systems."
  },
  {
    "start": 34.1,
    "end": 43.12,
    "text": "Every implicit assumption inside your cloud-your APIs Your East West traffic Is A Potential Breach That In Some Way Is Already In Progress."
  },
  {
    "start": 44.12,
    "end": 47.98,
    "text": "Zero Trust isn't The Product And It Isn't Optional."
  },
  {
    "start": 48.96,
    "end": 52.96,
    "text": "I'm Steve Prentice, and this is the Tallis Security Sessions podcast."
  },
  {
    "start": 66.72,
    "end": 70.08,
    "text": "To help us understand this complex relationship between humans."
  },
  {
    "start": 75.36,
    "end": 89.4,
    "text": "Chase has been working in the cybersecurity space for twenty-plus years, actively advising senior defense and intelligence leaders within the US Department of Defense as well other international government entities."
  },
  {
    "start": 89.76,
    "end": 95.68,
    "text": "As well also creating influential zero trust extended framework at Forrester Research."
  },
  {
    "start": 96.14,
    "end": 98.56,
    "text": "And this is just to name a couple of his achievements."
  },
  {
    "start": 99.22,
    "end": 100.56,
    "text": "So chase welcome."
  },
  {
    "start": 101.28,
    "end": 104.78,
    "text": "I would love start off by asking you how you got here."
  },
  {
    "start": 105.64,
    "end": 109.1,
    "text": "You are a unique and highly respected presence in the world of cybersecurity."
  },
  {
    "start": 109.22,
    "end": 113.08,
    "text": "So what path brought you to become Dr.. Zero trust?"
  },
  {
    "start": 113.72,
    "end": 118.94,
    "text": "Yeah, so I wish I could say that it was well planned out will form related strategic plan But it really wasn't."
  },
  {
    "start": 119.1,
    "end": 123.2,
    "text": "i've just been lucky enough To be In the right place at the right time kind of blessed."
  },
  {
    "start": 123.24,
    "end": 124.34,
    "text": "And the people had ran into."
  },
  {
    "start": 124.62,
    "end": 130.34,
    "text": "they'd all started way back when I joined The Navy actually to fix engines on boats because I thought That would Be cool."
  },
  {
    "start": 135.3,
    "end": 136.0,
    "text": "computer control."
  },
  {
    "start": 136.06,
    "end": 136.9,
    "text": "that never worked right."
  },
  {
    "start": 137.48,
    "end": 144.0,
    "text": "Long story short, I snuck up to a officer's state room and kind of commandeered the laptop to recalibrate the thing."
  },
  {
    "start": 144.64,
    "end": 150.32,
    "text": "And while i was doing that someone That wasn't in the executive group saw me Doing this thing which was highly illegal?"
  },
  {
    "start": 150.82,
    "end": 155.3,
    "text": "Yeah instead Of punishing me they said would you like To do something other than work on engines?"
  },
  {
    "start": 155.34,
    "end": 156.6,
    "text": "and i said please yes."
  },
  {
    "start": 157.16,
    "end": 159.82,
    "text": "And that's where basically The whole career path opened Up to me."
  },
  {
    "start": 160.08,
    "end": 165.12,
    "text": "so it Was Like I say, literally fortuitous events where i've been lucky enough to meet the right people."
  },
  {
    "start": 165.78,
    "end": 170.12,
    "text": "Well that story alone is extremely inspiring for people of any age and in any business."
  },
  {
    "start": 170.5,
    "end": 178.34,
    "text": "To realize it a clear path does not necessarily have to be mapped out in advance but your skills can help you make your own luck."
  },
  {
    "start": 179.04,
    "end": 185.06,
    "text": "So with regards to yourself and your profession, the concept of zero trust as a concept is not new."
  },
  {
    "start": 185.3,
    "end": 191.02,
    "text": "Many organizations have purchased Zero Trust solutions and committed to a zero-trust culture."
  },
  {
    "start": 191.9,
    "end": 198.14,
    "text": "others however might just simply buy a package or product or service and consider The solution complete at that point."
  },
  {
    "start": 199.0,
    "end": 208.82,
    "text": "So what separates the organizations that have actually improved their security outcomes with zero trust from those who simply accumulated zero-trust technologies?"
  },
  {
    "start": 208.96,
    "end": 209.34,
    "text": "What is"
  },
  {
    "start": 219.34,
    "end": 220.7,
    "text": "adapted and adopted?"
  },
  {
    "start": 220.8,
    "end": 222.94,
    "text": "Zero Trust as their kind of North Star."
  },
  {
    "start": 223.24,
    "end": 224.82,
    "text": "Does it matter to anybody on the far end?"
  },
  {
    "start": 225.16,
    "end": 228.76,
    "text": "If you call it zero trust, no because not like we're getting royalty checks or anything."
  },
  {
    "start": 229.2,
    "end": 233.1,
    "text": "The truth that matters though is what will be talked about in concept around."
  },
  {
    "start": 233.66,
    "end": 239.1,
    "text": "where things make a difference Is the controls that apply remove trust relationships from systems."
  },
  {
    "start": 239.28,
    "end": 242.76,
    "text": "And if really just take step back Take deep breath."
  },
  {
    "start": 242.94,
    "end": 243.64,
    "text": "look at cyber."
  },
  {
    "start": 243.7,
    "end": 249.46,
    "text": "in general Trust is a human emotion that should not be imbued to internet systems."
  },
  {
    "start": 249.88,
    "end": 251.66,
    "text": "It just causes risk and problems."
  },
  {
    "start": 251.88,
    "end": 255.2,
    "text": "So let's remove that, uh And I think that that's where we really see."
  },
  {
    "start": 255.82,
    "end": 258.66,
    "text": "the difference in organizations Is the ones that align on it?"
  },
  {
    "start": 258.959,
    "end": 262.22,
    "text": "They believe in strategy Not in Just death by more tech"
  },
  {
    "start": 263.6,
    "end": 264.76,
    "text": "Death By More Tech."
  },
  {
    "start": 264.96,
    "end": 265.84,
    "text": "i do like That!"
  },
  {
    "start": 266.58,
    "end": 271.02,
    "text": "And of course points To The fact that humans are completely In the middle Of this equation."
  },
  {
    "start": 271.76,
    "end": 280.58,
    "text": "employees, executives... all of us emotion-based beings who are likely to trust what we see without applying critical thinking or due diligence."
  },
  {
    "start": 281.24,
    "end": 282.12,
    "text": "That's how we're built!"
  },
  {
    "start": 282.66,
    "end": 294.98,
    "text": "So that's a problem when we look at things like social engineering fishing spoofing these are all crimes of distraction focused directly on the human preference to feel react rather than think."
  },
  {
    "start": 296.98,
    "end": 299.06,
    "text": "So what can organizations do about this?"
  },
  {
    "start": 299.38,
    "end": 304.1,
    "text": "After all, we were all trained to click on links from the very first time I used a computer."
  },
  {
    "start": 304.56,
    "end": 310.0,
    "text": "How come you get cultures now to get individuals who practice zero trust consciously and"
  },
  {
    "start": 310.04,
    "end": 310.62,
    "text": "consistently?\"."
  },
  {
    "start": 324.26,
    "end": 327.02,
    "text": "In general, it doesn't really make much change."
  },
  {
    "start": 327.08,
    "end": 330.7,
    "text": "Statistics kind of prove that and where we are now is what you should be looking at."
  },
  {
    "start": 330.96,
    "end": 337.42,
    "text": "how can I make the experience for users as frictionless possible but still have right security controls need to there?"
  },
  {
    "start": 338.32,
    "end": 343.22,
    "text": "It's a common ZT thing in the sort-of practicum."
  },
  {
    "start": 344.42,
    "end": 356.14,
    "text": "figure out how remove people from being avenue compromise by putting control not training them ridiculous things we rake him up with."
  },
  {
    "start": 356.38,
    "end": 361.96,
    "text": "let's put everybody on the system that requires you to interact with content and then say oh never mind don't direct without contact."
  },
  {
    "start": 362.6,
    "end": 378.56,
    "text": "We have had as a guest on this show in previous years is well known security specialist who goes by the name of fc, he has the type red teamer gets paid it break into hospitals other institutions companies not just breaking their networks but into these secure building itself."
  },
  {
    "start": 379.42,
    "end": 381.76,
    "text": "Fascinating guy, and he said the same kind of thing."
  },
  {
    "start": 381.82,
    "end": 389.1,
    "text": "He says we've trained people to work with a mouse at the click on links And it is unfair now to say you're wrong in doing that."
  },
  {
    "start": 389.58,
    "end": 390.98,
    "text": "So now what can we look at?"
  },
  {
    "start": 391.18,
    "end": 393.94,
    "text": "To start to solve such a dilemma?"
  },
  {
    "start": 394.9,
    "end": 396.86,
    "text": "I mean i think big broad soaks like."
  },
  {
    "start": 397.04,
    "end": 398.06,
    "text": "I just think What makes a difference?"
  },
  {
    "start": 398.12,
    "end": 405.52,
    "text": "right i'm A huge fan of browser isolation technology because That's how We interact With content and The browsers are great control plane to put controls In."
  },
  {
    "start": 405.62,
    "end": 406.56,
    "text": "does It Mean its bulletproof?"
  },
  {
    "start": 406.68,
    "end": 407.7,
    "text": "no but Is it a solid one?"
  },
  {
    "start": 407.76,
    "end": 415.56,
    "text": "yes multi-factor authentication massively reduces the avenue for compromise, because it is an out of band additional factor."
  },
  {
    "start": 416.44,
    "end": 423.54,
    "text": "And then also having a really good segmentation isolation control policy as well as good rule management event bound and outbound."
  },
  {
    "start": 424.0,
    "end": 430.94,
    "text": "It's funny Because all of the basic things that we've talked about for thirty years are basically what makes the most difference?"
  },
  {
    "start": 431.54,
    "end": 434.8,
    "text": "Yes AI might help you do that at a policy level."
  },
  {
    "start": 434.88,
    "end": 435.7,
    "text": "quicker better faster."
  },
  {
    "start": 436.16,
    "end": 441.5,
    "text": "but We haven't re-engineered how the internet works, we have not changed up our OSI model functions."
  },
  {
    "start": 441.96,
    "end": 443.24,
    "text": "None of this is totally new."
  },
  {
    "start": 443.62,
    "end": 451.08,
    "text": "it's just that we've continued to follow along with chasing market trends rather than actually going like well wait a minute."
  },
  {
    "start": 451.36,
    "end": 455.72,
    "text": "what stands at test time and must be present for bad guy when?"
  },
  {
    "start": 456.66,
    "end": 459.66,
    "text": "And upon whose shoulders does responsibility lie?"
  },
  {
    "start": 460.28,
    "end": 463.16,
    "text": "Is an IT or CISO obligation?"
  },
  {
    "start": 463.56,
    "end": 465.5,
    "text": "belong senior management in the C-suite?"
  },
  {
    "start": 465.9,
    "end": 471.9,
    "text": "So I think in reality where we're at is with a digital business, it's the leadership that is not necessarily IT people."
  },
  {
    "start": 472.24,
    "end": 479.16,
    "text": "We've done ourselves this service by putting on CISOs and security geeks to be one of those problems."
  },
  {
    "start": 479.66,
    "end": 487.8,
    "text": "when if i'm running or working as a business then my job role was take care of cyber-IT My job roles are keeping the business functioning."
  },
  {
    "start": 488.04,
    "end": 491.0,
    "text": "however If the business gets hacked...we go down."
  },
  {
    "start": 491.38,
    "end": 497.16,
    "text": "so there'a bigger play here kind of the two sides to meet in the middle."
  },
  {
    "start": 497.38,
    "end": 502.52,
    "text": "I think we need really good security people that can talk business and a really good business, people they can talk security."
  },
  {
    "start": 503.12,
    "end": 506.72,
    "text": "but this is at some level... This is a C-level conversation."
  },
  {
    "start": 506.86,
    "end": 507.34,
    "text": "has happened."
  },
  {
    "start": 507.42,
    "end": 510.26,
    "text": "The responsibility my opinion lies there."
  },
  {
    "start": 511.18,
    "end": 521.679,
    "text": "When you look at environments filled with cloud workloads and APIs and AI agents where are organizations still making implicit trust assumptions?"
  },
  {
    "start": 523.78,
    "end": 525.82,
    "text": "What are the gaps in between these solutions?"
  },
  {
    "start": 526.98,
    "end": 531.4,
    "text": "Most of time when you're looking at it, people have got a really good boundary of North-South traffic."
  },
  {
    "start": 531.54,
    "end": 543.84,
    "text": "They don't have good boundaries or understanding of East West and what we mean by that is to think about clouds...between infrastructure....between machines things along those lines because no one kind likes look into your own house and see whats going on."
  },
  {
    "start": 543.96,
    "end": 558.58,
    "text": "You okay with looking at driveway seeing if new cars coming leaving but most folks dont typically go around seeing what's going inside an infrastructure And that's where things go awry because if you approach, everything is good."
  },
  {
    "start": 559.1,
    "end": 564.74,
    "text": "So I think it was not having a control over what goes east-west and doesn't work out well."
  },
  {
    "start": 565.86,
    "end": 568.84,
    "text": "Is this something that would be established as daily activity?"
  },
  {
    "start": 569.24,
    "end": 572.78,
    "text": "A real time thing or more of an audit process?"
  },
  {
    "start": 574.94,
    "end": 576.64,
    "text": "What is the best way to deploy like"
  },
  {
    "start": 578.0,
    "end": 580.9,
    "text": "In the best way, it should be a real time or near-realtime."
  },
  {
    "start": 581.42,
    "end": 594.7,
    "text": "And then you have capabilities for seeing what's going on there and I think if you really look at it too from an audit perspective which your compliance and regulators are telling that we're moving towards this place where real-time is our requirement."
  },
  {
    "start": 594.8,
    "end": 598.58,
    "text": "so in space tech exists to do these things."
  },
  {
    "start": 599.2,
    "end": 613.16,
    "text": "its coming away like a glacier sliding down a hill now is when they start getting ahead of us The verifiable kind of reasons not to do it because the tech for these problems is very, very clear."
  },
  {
    "start": 614.04,
    "end": 622.18,
    "text": "Still It seems to be again one of those kinds of scenarios where people say the problem isn't here right now so I'm Not going to worry about it just like he was with Y-to-K."
  },
  {
    "start": 623.32,
    "end": 631.28,
    "text": "So let's look at a specific leadership challenge What elements of security culture or leadership mindset are non negotiable?"
  },
  {
    "start": 631.72,
    "end": 632.82,
    "text": "For success in this area"
  },
  {
    "start": 634.04,
    "end": 635.48,
    "text": "from my experience you need someone."
  },
  {
    "start": 635.52,
    "end": 640.32,
    "text": "that is the single point uh, command and control for security culture or security technology."
  },
  {
    "start": 640.4,
    "end": 647.14,
    "text": "All that stuff you can have someone that's triple-hatted with finance an IT in blah, blah whatever else they need to be."
  },
  {
    "start": 647.24,
    "end": 656.06,
    "text": "this is their job um And I also think that you need to have a space where The leadership the board as well Is very very deeply engaged?"
  },
  {
    "start": 656.1,
    "end": 658.6,
    "text": "In the security requirements and needs of that business."
  },
  {
    "start": 658.66,
    "end": 662.92,
    "text": "because like i said it is A difference between business survival and business failure."
  },
  {
    "start": 663.18,
    "end": 665.24,
    "text": "Um is not being able to secure your infrastructure."
  },
  {
    "start": 665.32,
    "end": 669.58,
    "text": "nowadays Technology again is something that should be leaned on heavily."
  },
  {
    "start": 670.0,
    "end": 672.56,
    "text": "People process, you know those are parts of it."
  },
  {
    "start": 672.66,
    "end": 675.92,
    "text": "but ultimately TACC is what's going to solve this problem at scale."
  },
  {
    "start": 677.38,
    "end": 689.22,
    "text": "and Of course while all this is going on large well-funded nation state threat actors continue To penetrate and persist And of course leverage the potential of quantum in terms of harvest now decrypt later."
  },
  {
    "start": 690.06,
    "end": 697.74,
    "text": "This all adds an additional layer or layers of urgency to any kinds of delays, or ambiguity surrounding any defense in depth measures."
  },
  {
    "start": 698.36,
    "end": 707.62,
    "text": "In general are you seeing organizations becoming more aware of these new sophisticated types of threats as opposed to the standard ransomware and data breach issues?"
  },
  {
    "start": 708.8,
    "end": 711.6,
    "text": "The government is very aware of it And they're very concerned about It."
  },
  {
    "start": 711.66,
    "end": 721.8,
    "text": "like for them Q-Day Is really About what happens when we start breaking encryption at the massive levels Encrypted is extremely concerning for them."
  },
  {
    "start": 722.64,
    "end": 747.54,
    "text": "I wouldn't say that they have necessarily a good solution yet, but when you're talking about corporate and non-federal, there are so inundated with everyday life and all the many moving parts their dealing with—that's beyond what they want to put into their risk register or thinking of it as an issue because we should at least be having some very legitimate conversations around this."
  },
  {
    "start": 748.64,
    "end": 753.88,
    "text": "Yes, but often what occurs in the face of looming threats is analysis paralysis."
  },
  {
    "start": 754.5,
    "end": 759.04,
    "text": "It is hard to keep things straight when everything is changing so much and so quickly."
  },
  {
    "start": 760.24,
    "end": 764.8,
    "text": "So what advice do you have for people who are feeling overwhelmed by how much they have to take on?"
  },
  {
    "start": 765.84,
    "end": 766.86,
    "text": "When I talk with people want."
  },
  {
    "start": 766.98,
    "end": 771.0,
    "text": "Do my consulting stuff as I remind them like this Is the one space where it's okay to be selfish."
  },
  {
    "start": 771.14,
    "end": 778.66,
    "text": "And what i mean By that is I can't fix everybody But I Can Take Care Of Me My Home My Business My People My Security those things."
  },
  {
    "start": 779.12,
    "end": 783.68,
    "text": "And if we're a harder target than you neighbor, that sucks for you but I'm not losing."
  },
  {
    "start": 783.78,
    "end": 789.16,
    "text": "so i think that is uh place of people should like perfect as the enemy of good."
  },
  {
    "start": 789.58,
    "end": 791.28,
    "text": "it's really what we're trying to get them understand."
  },
  {
    "start": 791.42,
    "end": 793.78,
    "text": "and you to your point on paralysis analysis."
  },
  {
    "start": 794.44,
    "end": 798.34,
    "text": "yeah you can be inundated with things but in security you don't have a choice."
  },
  {
    "start": 798.48,
    "end": 799.24,
    "text": "you figure it out."
  },
  {
    "start": 799.44,
    "end": 803.52,
    "text": "move because not moving um military tactics will tell ya."
  },
  {
    "start": 806.5,
    "end": 813.94,
    "text": "And we are, of course now in the age of AI which is dominating everything and it's being interpreted at many levels as Being The Solution for Everything."
  },
  {
    "start": 814.92,
    "end": 817.12,
    "text": "How Is This Impacting The Zero Trust Model?"
  },
  {
    "start": 817.86,
    "end": 822.06,
    "text": "What Words Of Caution Can You Provide To Those Who Believe In AI?"
  },
  {
    "start": 822.16,
    "end": 823.28,
    "text": "Just A Little Too Much."
  },
  {
    "start": 824.58,
    "end": 834.9,
    "text": "Well number one I remind people that none of this actually AI its machine learning with really good branding on top because That'S what We're Calling It Because Everyone and i mean thats a very real thing reason For People to Remind Themselves."
  },
  {
    "start": 834.98,
    "end": 837.18,
    "text": "That IS None of these things are self aware."
  },
  {
    "start": 837.26,
    "end": 838.8,
    "text": "they're not making their own decisions there."
  },
  {
    "start": 838.98,
    "end": 843.72,
    "text": "machines and applications that take input, use process a compute mathematics and then come out with something."
  },
  {
    "start": 844.14,
    "end": 859.16,
    "text": "We don't want self-aware systems though but doesn't play all well for people in general um... And where we're talking about zero trust is you can operate at the level that it's very very zero trustee at scale with this types solutions in place because i'll help if thats what your."
  },
  {
    "start": 859.22,
    "end": 862.96,
    "text": "therefore that's what machine do better than would be was operate speed skill."
  },
  {
    "start": 863.08,
    "end": 880.88,
    "text": "however If you are still sitting on the fence about not having or having an issue about these removals of trust and things along those lines You are playing with fire while you have a can of gasoline in your pocket like it is going to get bad for you very quickly because It's one thing to try and manage."
  },
  {
    "start": 881.46,
    "end": 885.28,
    "text": "A few hundred, or a few thousand particular issues or resources."
  },
  {
    "start": 886.3,
    "end": 894.9,
    "text": "Now you're dealing with people that can generate spin up their own applications around architectures and deploy them without having to know anything about security, coding technology etc."
  },
  {
    "start": 896.28,
    "end": 903.3,
    "text": "So the Pandora's box has been blown wide open and if you don't move now... ...the movement is coming for"
  },
  {
    "start": 903.38,
    "end": 903.46,
    "text": "you.\"."
  },
  {
    "start": 904.8,
    "end": 909.74,
    "text": "If you were hired tomorrow as the see-saw of a typical Fortune One Thousand company."
  },
  {
    "start": 910.72,
    "end": 915.48,
    "text": "what are the first three zero trust initiatives that would prioritize in your first ninety days?"
  },
  {
    "start": 916.16,
    "end": 918.22,
    "text": "And What Would You Deliberately Ignore?"
  },
  {
    "start": 919.48,
    "end": 924.8,
    "text": "Uh, the first thing I would do is a full on total scope red team up against anything and everything that we have."
  },
  {
    "start": 924.84,
    "end": 925.74,
    "text": "And I don't mean to pen test."
  },
  {
    "start": 925.78,
    "end": 929.96,
    "text": "I'm in a red team with physical and fishing an email and deep fakes and everything."
  },
  {
    "start": 930.1,
    "end": 935.76,
    "text": "The reason for that as I want to know where really weak because if we're going to fight the adversary, we got to know what were gonna lose right off the bat?"
  },
  {
    "start": 935.82,
    "end": 936.28,
    "text": "So that's number."
  },
  {
    "start": 936.44,
    "end": 944.66,
    "text": "one second thing I will do was a full review of all ended at any access management controls and protocols cause I wanna know what it's the easy avenue compromise."
  },
  {
    "start": 944.7,
    "end": 950.34,
    "text": "And then the third one would be an inventory of assets across the entirety at the company."
  },
  {
    "start": 950.62,
    "end": 958.28,
    "text": "I mean, every application firewall network blah-blah want to know what the map looks like so you can figure out where did deploy forces strategically?"
  },
  {
    "start": 958.96,
    "end": 964.24,
    "text": "Um and i think that puts in a place for your have good understanding of what is... ...and then move forward from there."
  },
  {
    "start": 964.36,
    "end": 966.1,
    "text": "it's bounded reality which is good."
  },
  {
    "start": 966.64,
    "end": 979.36,
    "text": "um What I would ignore Is trying to solve everything all at once.. ..I'd be extraceptionally pragmatic with everybody involved say look The goal for this is to find out where we are really weak and work our way going forward."
  },
  {
    "start": 979.4,
    "end": 992.76,
    "text": "And oh, by the way... We're not trying to out anybody or any organization whatever but we are going to work define where we have most likely avenue then fix that first because thats what bad guys do so.. That's were I would flip the script."
  },
  {
    "start": 993.96,
    "end": 999.54,
    "text": "My last question of you than is What a widely accepted belief about zero trust?"
  },
  {
    "start": 999.88,
    "end": 999.88,
    "text": "I"
  },
  {
    "start": 1002.24,
    "end": 1009.34,
    "text": "think for me, the biggest one is that we get most hit back on people saying they don't trust their workforce and it's not about that."
  },
  {
    "start": 1009.64,
    "end": 1010.52,
    "text": "Trust your work force."
  },
  {
    "start": 1010.64,
    "end": 1013.78,
    "text": "have drinks birthday parties whatever... That doesn't matter."
  },
  {
    "start": 1014.14,
    "end": 1017.94,
    "text": "What were talking about was removing trust relationships from systems."
  },
  {
    "start": 1018.06,
    "end": 1018.56,
    "text": "And yes!"
  },
  {
    "start": 1018.98,
    "end": 1020.2,
    "text": "That applies to you're people."
  },
  {
    "start": 1021.6,
    "end": 1023.78,
    "text": "It just a reality of what going on."
  },
  {
    "start": 1024.56,
    "end": 1026.66,
    "text": "The last part i would say comes up all time."
  },
  {
    "start": 1027.04,
    "end": 1030.66,
    "text": "A start with this zero-trust isnot product its strategy."
  },
  {
    "start": 1031.7,
    "end": 1032.16,
    "text": "I love that."
  },
  {
    "start": 1032.599,
    "end": 1041.56,
    "text": "We certainly need much more of that kind of humanness and emotional intelligence inside our working environments, so Dr."
  },
  {
    "start": 1041.619,
    "end": 1042.98,
    "text": "Chase Cunningham, Dr."
  },
  {
    "start": 1043.119,
    "end": 1046.839,
    "text": "Zero Trust it has been such a pleasure to meet with you."
  },
  {
    "start": 1055.82,
    "end": 1072.4,
    "text": "Chase tells me he has two books in the works looking forward to both of those and In the meantime, you can benefit from his wisdom on a range of cybersecurity topics And global issues by checking out and subscribing to this YouTube channel Which is at Dr."
  },
  {
    "start": 1072.6,
    "end": 1075.06,
    "text": "Zero Trust that is youtube.com."
  },
  {
    "start": 1075.18,
    "end": 1080.1,
    "text": "slash the ad sign DRZEROTRUST."
  },
  {
    "start": 1081.04,
    "end": 1081.58,
    "text": "All spelled out."
  },
  {
    "start": 1083.04,
    "end": 1098.84,
    "text": "And remember, if you like what you hear on this podcast please be sure to subscribe here too and tell a friend or colleague or client about the Tallis Security Sessions Podcast series not just for next one but our collection of highly useful and always relevant conversations."
  },
  {
    "start": 1099.5,
    "end": 1107.9,
    "text": "We will back again soon with another episode discussion on topics that need to know about successfully carry-on in business information security."
  },
  {
    "start": 1108.88,
    "end": 1110.98,
    "text": "Until then I'm Steve Prentice."
  },
  {
    "start": 1111.74,
    "end": 1113.06,
    "text": "Thanks for listening."
  }
]